fraud\scam or good service??

does anyone really know if Silverthorn & Lupolover, Lawyers, LLP is actually a scam or not ?
i recently signed on with them but haven't made my first payment yet is due tomorrow and while i was searching more info on them i came across your postings stating it was a scam has this been proven any where? as i signed an internet agreement where it collects my ip addy to verify my signature on the agreement,if it is a scam is it still binding?has any one else had dealings with them?...i tried to contact the BBB but was just after 4:30 when i saw the info so all the gov. offices were closed and couldn't get any info any on it. my payment is due in the bank tomorrow and i am at a loss what to do now as now gov. office is open until monday now even tried the canadian anti fraude center and it was closed other places were only autoimated messages that weren't very helpfull at all! so please if you have info\proof that they are a scam please post it and help ty.
ty very much in advance for any help you can provide it is greatly appreciated,
lost and confused

Is there a chance you could confine your pleas to a single thread?

The few search engine results don't look good for this outfit. In general, debt "settlement" firms do nothing of the sort. In the worst scenario, they pile up your money while your various accounts slide into default. Weeks later the collections calls are melting down your phone and you may be sued eventually. The "debt fixer" meanwhile has done all the nothing about this it planned to from the start.

In the next best case, the firm contacts your creditors, swings some token discount, and pockets a percentage of your alleged savings. The danger here is this can drag out the time it will take to reach a zero balance, and nothing stops the creditor from playing the usual games which make credit more costly and push people into default.

In neither case is this middleman exerting special powers. You can perform a "strategic default" by yourself and for free. You can call creditor service numbers to renegotiate your APR or other terms, again by yourself and for free. You have the same chance of success and much less to lose.

I can't say how things work in your province, but an IP address does not solidly identify a single person. If you're saying your due date is a Sunday that also seems dubious. If your neck hairs are standing up, don't commit to a payment until your doubts are confirmed or dismissed. Get on the homework you should have done before being convinced this firm upheld your best interests. If distrust remains and you've given away any funding source account numbers, you might consider closing those accounts.

i truly apologize for the multiple posts but was not sure which thread it belonged in and was worried if posted to wrong 1 it would just be deleted from that area.

That being said, thank you for taking the time to reply to my questions.it was my husband who set up the arrangements while i was away thinking he researched it enough and tough it was an legitimate operation he agreed to their agreement documents which had been emailed to him and signed them online and did a verbal agreement at the same time as signing and when the document was saved it showed where he had signed it digitally collected his ip addy which i understand there is no way to prove who actually signed the agreement,but with it being verbal as well giving some personal information to verify who he was( which i know was a huge mistake for him to do you never just give that out but he is not as knowledgeable when it comes to these areas which he figured he was just helping finally having a solution for us)

When i did return i looked over the info he researched it did look legitimate. All the information he had found and also the Lawyer is registered with the law society of upper Canada.So it did look ok but something just was still not sitting right with me so i did some of my own research and found positive and negative feed back about him which made things more confusing to decide on the facts.

Also that Saturday\ Sunday date which it was to start was purely by coincidence as my husband just happened to pick the 5th of each month for our payment to be in the bank by which just happened to be a Saturday for our first payment to start on.


I was in a panic as it was Friday when i had returned in the afternoon and our first payment would have been due this past weekend which i wasn't sure if we should commit to given all the unanswered questions so i tried many business offices the anti fraud line ,the BBR but since it was 4:30 they had just closed (go figure lol) and was at a loss to whether or not to stick to the agreement and not knowing for sure if the agreement was actually legally binding or not would there be repercussions from not sticking to the agreement this is why i had posted the question in your forums as this is where i got most of the information saying it was probably a scam so i wanted to know if the person that posted it had anymore proof as i could not contact any one else until after our first payment was to be paid and i was hoping it would help clarify the situation a bit more to help make the decision until i could contact more authorities on Monday to get more information but needed to make a quick decision fast as next day was payment day so was confused on what to do on the limited information i had.

Then i could  contact the business to deal with the information and my concerns to see what could be resolved.

Needless to say we did not make the payment as if it is a scam, you never get your money back from them even if they get reprimanded for wrong doing\shady dealings.

When i did call around on Monday to do as much research as i could, they only all said," did you get scammed "? i stated no not yet but ...and then they said, well he is a legal lawyer even if not accredited not all businesses have to be accredited they said.
So i am really no further ahead still confused and now i have them calling me as well now to and might be reprimanded for breaking the agreement if they can hold us accountable to it.

I know we can call them ourselves and negotiate but assumed being just a person and not a business they would try to get the max possible and not be very interested in negotiating.

As they said they as companies have them settle max $0.42 on every dollar to i 5- 10 cents on every dollar,and they were know more the laws and rights then we do and that also would be their advantage.

i do want it settled the best way possible it was the interest that killed us we could never get caught back up when i lost my job due to a back injury and now have to settle with 1/4 the income i had and still all the bills plus more lol.

I will post 2 links 1 is to your forms here stating he is a scam and the other to his site and you will see why it is so confusing, but also the person that posted on here that he is a scam must have some sort of info to back up their allegations  but where can you find that proof\information?

your thread with the post https://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-416-800-1779/2#p311268679928987332
comment was posted by a person nick named     Annoyed

That is why i posted that question on your forums area in hopes to get that person or anyone else with that specific  information to message me so i could ask them more questions

This is the web page the business gave us mind you they have many others similar ones posted online
they also have many phone #'s that reach them,1 is posted to your site which led me to in my search for info on them it is the 1-647-0303 that yous have posted that they usually call me from
the web page they gave me and as i earlier stated he is registered with the law society of upper canada and on his site has lost info the show his history and back his story up so hard to know what the real truth is his web page      http://www.debtrelieflaw.ca/  

I know this is not your problem and issue and appreciate all the help and advice you have given me i greatly appreciate thank you.

They should have more info more readily available to the public to help them make properly informed decisions,and should keep track better of these scammers and have a place we can call to confirm if a business is or is not a scam as when i asked the anti fraud place and many others if there was such a place they said no but there defiantly is a need for 1.

i also fully agree with you that their service fees should not come out before the help you,while helping you yes part payment to them and some to creditors i agree with that or at the half way point get their money i don't under stand why it has to come out first as it stands the way they have the agreement set up we would be paying them for more then 6m with out anything going to the creditors as we have to stop payments to them so they can bargain with them then we can be sued as you say.

Stuck between a rock and a hard place...lol...think will try to see if they will take their money at half way point or after done services it will help show me that they are a more trust worthy company.
off to do more research for info thank you again and also thank you for the very informative site yous provide to help many others it is amazing.

*Also so sorry for the long winded reply, just lots weighing on my mind trying to sort all the info.*

Your anxiety was understandable, and your decision to stall on payment was wise. I did glance at the number thread and website before responding. That "Dan Grant" has provided a lot of homework reading a few days ago. I haven't had the time to peruse, but that much research may be worth examination and point you to hidden resources.

The S&L promo site is a fairly typical slap-up with entire sections "coming soon" ... probably more like "coming never". It's full of fuzzy assurances and pleasant clip art, but the fact that its CEO is adept at marketing does not make him honest. We in the States have plenty of these friendly-looking "fixers" too, saturating our media with warm promises and "debt solutions" we can ill afford.

The site copy comes right out and says that their great plan is for you to walk away from creditors and wait for them to go defaulted. You don't need Slick Willie to hold your hands and pocket your grocery money if that's your strategy. The consensus I've seen holds that these firms will only leave you poorer and in worse trouble.

So if you crash the plane solo, the first thing lenders do at default is reprice your account and consider you in breach of contract, making it harder to pay down whatever balance. Of course, if your cash flow is thin, the difference between a hundred and a thousand dollar balance begins to shrink. This is not a risk-free path, but people are forced that way all the time, and our brand name lenders all count on this happening after a consumer has been drained of options. It's part of their business model to see that we fail as debtors.

You're right that card lenders (and government agencies) tend to believe "It's not a problem until it's a problem" and won't cut new deals until you miss payments. Making yourself a bad risk becomes a twisted self-fulfilling prophecy. However, you as a bank customer can ostensibly vote with your dollars and transfer the balance someplace nicer. This outvotes anything a side bettor like a "debt fixer" can do, which plans to starve out the bank anyway! Ask for the terms which favor you, a lower APR or whatever. You find out for yourself who wants your business and who just wants your money, and act accordingly.

As to your immediate issue, my instinct would be to review this dubious agreement and see what S&L *thinks* can be done if you don't cooperate. Then compare that to your provincial laws to see how liable you are without ever signing a paper document.

In your place I would look very hard at the piling compounded interest and your real chances of ever breaking even. Look at how your lenders have treated you. Decide for yourself if you want to preserve or abandon the relationships. You're pretty much renting your own money at a given desperate point. Do your creditor landlords care enough? If not, default and collector disputes and bankruptcy get on the option table. This is not a moral issue but a business problem, one faced every day by your indebted neighbors.

For the record, this is not "my" site, just one I value and defend. In a way it belongs to all who contribute good intel.

Just came across this as i am about to enter the same process. Debt settlement. All i can say the people at Silverthorn & Lupolover, Lawyers, LLP were really aggressive and i felt something was not right. With more research and some phone calls i came across Mark silverthorn agency who are fantastic. LLP take more percentage and dont tell you everything. The latter agency seem to be more aware of the whole process and you feel more comfortable dealing with them. However, both processes work. Good luck

I'm still confused?  I signed up with S&L Lawyers for debt relief, but I have a bad feeling in my stomach about it!  I don't know what to do!  Please help, thanks!

i did sign with s&l dec.11. payment not due till jan.10 2012.were on the same page. where they able to take monies out of your acct? what did you do?

i signed up with them too. i have a bad feeling as well. what did you do ? did you brake the contract? are we able to do that? thanks

I have been with SSL for 4 mounths and I am a signal woman on UI and not beening abale to work do to illness Iam starting to get worried. I just had a clector tell me that I will have to clam bankrupt Not wanting to do this Iam very upset. Thanks for any help.

Have you heard anything?

hey if anyone is out there...u these people 4 real.....?? my husband is enrolled in the same program...and as well can't find info whether these guys are legit or not...however one thing is that the creditors have stopped calling...i guess its like buying  used car....its buyer beware?!?!  if anyone has any info regarding whether these guys are legit or not it would be great is they posted it....thanks

Well reputable or not, explain how in anyone's mind that a legal firm calls and elderly person, befriends them over the phone then gets them to disclose personal information, financial information, asks if they have children and if they are home and then offer to consolidate their finances. Their representative calls my mother who is a senior, late in the day, talks to her for 2 hours on the phone, tells her they can help her and 2 people will be over later...which is after 7pm in the dark...to a senior residence...really? Then they actually fax the documents to a taxi firm and ask the driver to have her sign the documentation and issue them a void cheque. Are you kidding me? My mother is certified ill with Alzheimer and can't authorize any such transaction yet i guess they've spoken to her for 2 hours and think she's good enough to commit to a contract and afterwords if she wants out it , it will cost her more then her savings to battle through it. Shame of you. Thankfully i was around and i had the police on the property to review the situation. DO NOT DEAL WITH THESE GUYS. Anybody that tells a senior citizen that they are legally contracted with Revenue Canada to help seniors consolidate debt must be out of there minds.

I've been enrolled with Silverthorn and Lupolover for 1 year now and there are bumps in the road. It wasn't a smooth transaction, though the representative warned me about this. I still pursue with the program, it's been a year now and they actually settled 2 of my creditors. And yes, gimpymicky was correct, the creditors did stop calling. Again, it was a process before they stopped calling. At first I was very skeptical as well. Once I got the welcome call, I was still skeptical about the whole thing. But the one thing that really kept me going is there customer service. Every time I had a problem, they were always there, they were always courteous to me. That's one reason why I continued my program with them. And true enough, 2 accounts are already settled. 1 more year and I'm debt free!

While Resident47 has done his usual good job of responding to this post, I'd like to add the following general observations.  None of this is specific to the firm you have mentioned.

The debt relief industry has a well deserved bad reputation.  If you need legal help with your debts you should see a local attorney with experience in this area.  Doing this sort of thing with strangers over the Internet is the very essence of a bad idea.

If you are determined to proceed, go ask a local attorney to vet these people for you.  It shouldn't cost you much, and it will be a lot less than the money you are about to lose.  If he tells you that these folks are bad news, I'm betting a letter from a "real attorney" will send these people on to an easier mark.  If he tells you they are legitimate and competent (don't hold your breath) then the small fee you paid (if any) will have given you some real peace of mind.

Incidentally, some of the posts here strike me as being suspicious in authorship and veracity.

Some things you should read:

<http://consumerinformation.ca/app/oca/ccig/html.do?page=focuson3&language=eng>

<http://getoutofdebt.org/33669/canadians-warned-about-debt-reduction-companies>

<http://www.canadian-money-advisor.ca/threadview/606.html>

<http://www.nomoredebts.org/Blog/debt-settleme ... ams-canada.html>

<http://www.ic.gc.ca/eic/site/oca-bc.nsf/eng/home>

<http://www.nomoredebts.org/debt-settlement-companies-dangers-canada.html>

I had 4 credit cards with the same bank (name withheld) that were maxed out at over 25K and I did look into these debt relief places.  All I got was multiple phone calls, aggressive salespeople and lots of phony guarantees.  After consulting with a friend (an attorney) I called the bank directly-by myself-and worked out a repayment plan with a professional rep from the bank.  Yes the cards were all closed and it shows that I am in a repayment plan on my credit report BUT it is 100 times better than winging it with some fly-by-night "debt relief/credit repair" company that actually charges you on top of the payments for doing what you could have done yourself.  Remember, these scammers want your money-nothing more-they don't care if you settle your debt or not-as long as they get paid.